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 Subject: RE: Works and Faith for salvation
 
Author: Joyce
Date:   10/29/2009 1:51 pm CDT
Hi Mark,

I still don't see how the works called for in the Mosaic Law don't qualify as works that complete one's faith, but I will let it go at that.

I would however, like to comment on Matt. 25:32. In my opinion, the ones who went into everlasting punishment were the same kind of beings as those who knew the daughters of men in Gen. 6. They were the progeny of fallen angels. If you are interested in that subject it is explained in the paper on my web-site (www.rightwordtruth.com) called "Who Will Go Into Everlasting Punishment?". That title can be found under the category "Papers On Death And Resurrection". It is one of those subjects that needs to be considered in its entirety as oppossed to piecemeal on a discussion board. To bring up only parts would, I believe do a disservice to what I consider to be truth.

Going on to other comments, you wrote, "what about those in other dispensations? Some say they had to have faith to be saved, and I would agree. Faith is the vehicle for salvation in all dispensations. But WHAT was that faith in, say, under the Law?".

We read in Heb. 11 of those who had faith. Each one believed a different message and acted upon that message and were saved. Noah, for example was made righteous because he believed God's message to him about the rains and acted on that message by building the ark that God told him to build.

My point is that, as you will see in Heb. 11, each believed a different message, but each believed the message that God had for him and acted upon that message. (By the way, that's faith completed by works.) And that brings me to Rom. 2:13-15 which reads, "For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another". This passage tells us that Gentiles will be justified by obeying their conscience. The message God had for those without the law was to obey their conscience, and if they did that, they completed their faith.

Now your question, "But WHAT was that faith in, say, under the Law?". As I understand your question you are asking in effect, what did Israel have to believe in order to be made righteous? Let's consider Lev. 26 in addressing that question.

Lev. 26 is a chapter where God says in effect that if Israel will obey His law, He will bless them and if they disobey He will punish them. If Israel believed that God had given them the law they would obey it, and if they did not believe God had given it to them, they would ignore it. Therefore, it seems to me that obedience to the law of Moses showed faith in God and that the law had been given by God.

Then you wrote, "How about during the tribulation? Sure, they will look back at the death, burial, and resurrection. But they will also have to have works. How else do they escape the mark of the Beast?".

They will escape the mark of the beast by not receiving it. Yes, some will lose their lives, but by not receiving the mark of the beast they will consummate their faith in Christ.

I have a feeling that all these questions are tied to one core belief, but I can't find that core belief. It might help if I understood it.

In Christ,

Joyce





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 Topics Author  Date      
 Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Mark 10/28/2009 4:46 pm CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Joyce 10/29/2009 10:15 am CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Mark 10/29/2009 10:40 am CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation    
Joyce 10/29/2009 1:51 pm CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Mark 10/29/2009 4:08 pm CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Joyce 10/29/2009 5:40 pm CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Mark 10/30/2009 10:10 am CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Lynn 10/30/2009 5:13 pm CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Mark 11/2/2009 2:14 pm CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Joyce 11/2/2009 3:04 pm CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Joyce 11/2/2009 3:25 pm CDT
 RE: Works and Faith for salvation   new  
Lynn 11/2/2009 7:23 pm CDT
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